I agree about the pageantry , but very much disagree about the cage. It’s fucking terrible and only kept as tradition and for marketing. Considering the UFC (which effectively runs MMA in the West) has branded itself with the cage and octogon shape it will never get changed, but it is horse shit for viewing and fighting. It’s funny, I was just watching a video for car MMA and thought it was so gimmicky, but let’s be honest while the cage isn’t as egregious, it’s in the same family.
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the mexicans love their chingasos, they ain’t never letting boxing die
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I don’t know man. Obviously hardcore fans prefer PRIDE rules (myself included) but I don’t know how far that version of MMA would have spread. I think it would have been popular here in the states and in other places like Eastern Europe, Russia, Japan, etc… but soccer kicks and headbutts would be way too much for the average person. The Unified Rules made MMA way more digestible for the common man, one who doesn’t engage in martial arts whatsoever…
Not to say that keeping MMA more concentrated and less globally popular would be a bad thing (cause I think it would be good), I just think leaving it that way drastically changes the landscape of the sport we see today.
There may be a compromise between Unified and PRIDE that makes sense for both crowds. Soccer kicks are banned but kicking/kneeing downed opponent to the head is legal (as long as they aren’t on their back), 12-6 elbows legal, and yellow cards.
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You make a fair point about the cage. It is a lot worse for fans in attendance than a ring,I think the overall visual of it isnt as good either. Not sure why but it just makes things seem “smaller” in some way. Then again, like I said, the cage is synonymous with MMA and is part of its distinct identity. Rings arent ideal for grappling either. But I dunno…i’m okay with either.
I think MMA is definitely more exciting on average, AND more casual friendly tbh. If we are talking the absolute cream of the crop fights then I havent seen an MMA fight on the level of stuff like Corrales/Castillo, Gatti/Ward etc etc, but imo if you put a UFC card on in a bar or at a party or whatever its going to get more of a reaction than the typical PBC/Top Rank/Matchroom etc etc card. For one with boxing you’re regularly gonna see fights on the undercards between guys nobody really cares about but also going much longer than UFC main events/title fights. Also MMA has a lot more crazy “viral” type content ie spinning shit, flying shit, slams etc etc. More visible damage, more upsets, more of a sense that at any moment either fighter could do something crazy and the fight could end.
I think One FCs style of Muay Thai, Bare knuckle and kickboxing are probably the top 3 combat sports for average level of excitement though. K-1 in the 90s/00s should have been much bigger than it was.
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I should clarify, I meant for the average viewer^
To anyone who has trained, MMA can be super exciting, but I’ve had plenty of times where I’ve watched good fights with non-combat sport fans and they lose interest once it goes to the ground because they don’t know what’s going on. Boxing is more easy to understand. Hell, I’ve had my elderly mother stop and watch a boxing match when she has passed by and saw a lot of action.
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I love what ONE FC is doing. It still pales to PRIDE/DREAM, but it’s a great product. I also agree that K1 and Glory for that matter should have been much larger here.
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Yes I agree I didn’t like that Pride banned elbows it’s supposed to be a fight so to be able to kick, knee or stomp the head of a grounded opponent but not be allowed to throw an elbow seems illogical.
I’m 50/50 on headbutts but am open to arguments on both sides.
I think the Cage is safer for fighters but to me it should be small WEC sized cage the standard UFC one is too big IMHO and allows fighters to flee and not engage. Smaller cage help to create more action and more KOs but like you say the ring looks more aesthetically pleasing.
What do you think about this hexagon shaped ring with chainlink at the bottom to prevent fighters from falling out?
Agree wish the UFC would put more efforts into events as well and make them a spectacle like Pride. They are so stale and boring by comparison.
I think most people like that stuff which is why I once thought Pride would lead the way in making MMA the world’s second most popular sport. However we all know what happened after they lost their TV deal in 2006.
This is just my anecdotal experience but I think it could have some merit.
In 2014 the UFC made an effort to increase their audience in the UK by having a fight night (Gustaffson vs Manuwa) on a free to air TV channel. Backed up with lots of advertising and hype.
People I knew who tuned in to MMA for the first time were not really impressed with what they saw. Part of that was many fighters fighting safe so as not to lose. Given that the UFC back then tended to cut anyone who lost 3 in a row.
Yet when I showed these same people some of my Pride DVD’s they had a different view. They loved the pageantry but also loved seeing people kick, knee and head stomp a grounded opponent.
There was an excitement to the action that was sorely lacking in the UFC.
This further cemented in my head at least that Pride had the potential to reach people where the dull stale unified rules UFC could not. Just my opinion of course.
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I think the best rules would be PRIDE, but with elbows ONLY for championship fights or finals of a Gran Prix.
The problem with a hexagon, octagon, circle, or any shape other than a square is that there are no 90 degree corners. You lose a ton of techniques (both offensively and defensively) when you get rid of them.
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A lot of small time promotors think this and it’s stupid.
It just makes more time be spent in the most boring position: cage wrestling. It doesn’t favor the better guy winning or more action.
If people want to just watch retards try to punch each other and think footwork is “fleeing” they should watch toughman.
The sport isn’t for everyone. We should stop compromising it to try to be. It’s our own fault, we wanted to be mainstream and on ESPN and what that got us an objective drop in card quality, the thoughtful analysis of Snoop Dogg and Stephen A Smith, and a bunch of Jake Paul fan NPCs asking about the next Conor fight.
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Yeah but as someone who has fought in a square cage, when you get someone stuck in a 90° corner on the ground you lose a lot of techniques offensive and defensive as well.
It’s a tricky balancing act with combat arena design. Big octagon is the best balance of fair and fan friendly
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Oh, the cage sucks no matter what shape. I get that the ring had it’s problems with having to put them in the center, but having a fence you can smash someone against, but they cannot grab is beyond retarded.
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There were stats that I do not have to hand but they clearly showed that there were more finishes in a smaller cage. Therefore making the action more exciting for the fans.
John McCarthy said fighters like to ‘‘flee’’ in a bigger cage. So what do you think of him then?
The quality drastically dropped long before the ESPN deal. It started with Fox in 2011
John McCartney is a thousand years old and has never fought in any of them, and he is widely regarded by fans and commentators accurately as one of the refs who loves to hear himself speak and make himself the center of attention during fights.
John was good for a certain time period. Modern MMA is not one of them
Because smaller shows use smaller cages. Mismatches lead to more finishes, not smaller cages
Soccer kicks knees to the head…yes…head butts…no
This I couldn’t agree more with.
I wasn’t specifically calling out the ESPN deal, more referencing how people used to say “man, one day we’ll be in the sports center top ten”
I still remember the Harris x Branch ko being on sports center and MMA fans losing their minds
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Well I appreciate you have a different perspective being a fighter but from a fan point of view the WEC sized Cage was more exciting.
When used in the UFC on occasions it resulted in more finishes too compared to average.
In my opinion it also played a part in Stipe’s defeat to Ngannou in the second fight. If it had been in a bigger cage it would have been easier to him to avoid Francis but a smaller cage forced more engagement.
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My opinion on this is again that it is more a function of skill discrepancies. The UFCs done in the small cage are historically because they are in smaller venues that don’t have space for the big one and the catwalk. Those cards also tend to have fewer top 5 guys and more contenders and showcase matches, which again lead to more finishes.
There are specific style matches it favors more than others. It favors wrestlers/grapplers generally
That may be but IMO the small cage favored Stipe in that fight because he could have shot and clinched much more easily.
That particular fight is a weird one because he size difference is so vast and Stipe looked like he just woke up out of bed and hadn’t trained for it.